Dear Yankee fans, stop clamoring for Johnny Damon
Wednesday, January 20, 2010 at 12:45 am by SJK
For the Yankee fans still urging the Yankees' FO to sign Johnny Damon, it's time to move on. The Yankees in-house options are fine.
First, by all reports, the Yankees are at the edge of their budget right now, and unless Damon is willing to take a enormous pay cut, he's not coming back. And considering Jerry Hairston signed for $2.12 million, we don't think Damon will settle for that type of cash. Come on, you all know he has X-Men genetics and the body of Lee Haney. He's the new Cal Ripken and better than Rickey Henderson.
Second, is his overall production going to be significantly better than any of the potential starting OFs on the Yankee roster? Will it even be better at all? The man will be 36 and one could make a serious argument that 2009 was his best offensive season ever. Is it reasonable to assume some dropoff in 2010? We think so. And we all know about his defense last season.
And for whatever it's worth, the virgin fans who make their own projections at Fangraphs have Damon being outperformed on an overall basis (defense included) by Brett Gardner (in 170 less PAs, mind you).
So whether you put faith in those projections or not, we think most people would agree that logically, once you take out the CLUBHOUSE CHEMISTRY!! rationale, we don't see how the re-signing of Johnny Damon would make the Yankees that much better, if at all.
Looks like Scotty and Johnny priced themselves out of the market.
*Props to Mick Shrimpton, Vizzini, Marshall Seymour, & Michael Knight for also contributing to this post*
tell me how a 110-120 ops+ player doesn’t improve your team when he is replacing a 90 ops+ player?
yes Damon has a bad arm, and he doesn’t cover as much ground as he used to, but I can’t remeber even one instance from last year where that really hurt us.
Resign him, and we will repeat.
Resgin him and we repeat? you are a clown.
Vazquez is the signing that is allowing us to repeat.
We got Vazquez via Trade.
If Damon could still play LF adequately, I would be all for re-signing him. But, what would be the point of re-signing a player who is essentially another DH-type when we already have Nick Johnson, who is arguably a better hitter? Even if he were to accept Hairston money, which he almost certainly wouldn’t, there would be very little playing time left for him with Johnson around.
You really don’t remember a time when Johnny didn’t catch a fly that ended up resulting in a hit?
And a 90+ (probably about 100) OPS+ player is more valuable than a 110 OPS+ player when the 110 OPS+ is an old man who shits his pants in left field and the 100 OPS+ player is great in the field
“yes Damon has a bad arm, and he doesn’t cover as much ground as he used to, but I can’t remeber even one instance from last year where that really hurt us.”
This is pretty much the definition of selection bias. This is why they invent stats, because your memory lies to you and can’t quantify things as well as a purely quantitative system does and just such a system (UZR) said it hurt the Yankees a crap ton.
Is it perfect? No. Is it probably much closer to reality than your memory? I’ll go with yes.
Johnny’s defense was absolutely atrocious last year. While I don’t have 100% faith in UZR/150 because it fluctuates so much, he did cost the team over a win on defense in 2009…
“we don’t see how the re-signing of Johnny Damon would make the Yankees that much better, if at all.”
Are you serious? Did you not watch how over-matched Brett Gardner was last year?? Even if Gardner improves, and that a big if, he isn’t nearly the player Damon is, even in a down year. The only thing Gardner has on Damon are his legs… and last time I checked Gardner makes some pretty boneheaded baserunning plays using them… even his arm is sadly only slightly better than Damon’s. Yeah sure, Gardner will get to more fly balls in the gap, but in my humble opinion, Gardner is more valuable as a pinch runner off of the bench, than as an everyday outfielder.
Ultimately, it comes down to money, and the Yanks have a ton of it, esp w/ the New Stadium, a new championship… yada, yada, yada. If you honestly think we’re a better team with Gardner over Damon, I want some of what you’re smoking… either way, the Yanks are stacked, I just know we’re a much better team with Damon.
“Even if Gardner improves, and that a big if, he isn’t nearly the player Damon is, even in a down year.”
Let’s go with your hypothetical situation:
Gardner had a 2.1 WAR in half a season of ABs while Damon, who by all accounts had a career year (at the ripe age of 35), had a 3.0 WAR. Prorate Gardner’s batting runs, which for the sake of your argument, are better than last years and over more playing time, not to mention his vastly superior defensive value (again, over a longer period of playing time) and it’s pretty obvious his production could match Johnny’s.
Now, if you’re going to offhandedly dismiss my argument with another ever so eloquent “Are you serious?” I’d prefer you try and back it up with something more than statements made without any evidence.
I just read that Nick Johnson is arguably a better hitter than Johnny Damon.
You guys are F&cking stupid.. for those who said Gardy is better then Johnny, stop. Stop.. Johnny could be slower and older and weaker arm.. But he owns that right field porch, he still has power, contact, and he can still steal bases.. You ignorants probably forgot the offense he played at the World Series, maybe if it wasn’t for him the yankees probably had never won game four.. When Damor had a 9 pitch at bat, singled, then stole 2nd and 3rd.. the man is good .. but I guess we going to have to wait and see.. I’m sure Gardner will not be the LF starter.. anyways if he does it won’t be for long .. after the 2010 season is over I’m pretty sure Yankees are going after. Crafford..
Nomaas I really used to like your site, but you continue to make very dumb arguments for Brett Gardner to play everyday in the OF.
If you’re really suggesting that a full season of Brett Gardner/whatever other bum they might pick up off the scrap heap…would be better than a full season of Johnny Damon…you are insane.
Stop worrying about the Yankee’s money too. Are you Hal or Hank? Why are you so worried about a budget? Since when has any Yankee fan even cared about a budget…win at all costs. It’s not any of our money. So sit in your 100 dollar upper deck job and enjoy a full year of Brett Gardner. LOL @ you guys. You are the biggest schmucks to walk the earth.
Also the above photoshop is terrible. Just horribly done.
How many big hits has Brett Gardner had in a WS or playoff game? Give me that stat Nomaas.
butcher breaking out the clutch argument. What a tool.
I think some people posting here would suck off Johnny Damon if they had the chance.
To suggest the Yankees are a “much better team” with Johnny Damon. The guy was so bad in LF last season. Doesn’t defense count for anything with you people?
How many fly balls has Brett Gardner caught in a WS or playoff game. Give me that stat.
Brett Gardner>Joe D
imagine having a real life conversation with “butcher.” You probably become dumber just by listening to him.
Statistics? We do not need to worry about such things.
LF in 2010 will be weaker than 2009 no matter who is out there (Gardy/Damon/Johnson or some other over paid slob) and that is by design.
The team has upgraded in other areas (Granderson and Vazquez), and wants a cheap option. It can tolerate the 9 whole coming from LF so long as the defense is solid. I agree with a previous post; LF in 2011 will be Crawford.
Improved Gardner offense coupled with his defense and speed would make him as valuable as Johnny Damon. God, agreeing with these schmucks for once is a task in and of itself.
Also, LOL!@ someone using LeisureSuitLarry as their name. That is hilarious.
I have a massive black cock. dont hate
If he costs 3 Million, its a no-brainer… You sign him. The guy can still play and if nothing else, he provides depth and a security blanket incase someone goes down for the season.
Time for NoMaas to shut down these comment sections attached to their posts. They add nothing to what has been a very good site. Seriously, the snark here is not even clever. And what’s up with the racist and homophobic clowns that chime in every few comments?
BLAH BLAH BLA|||
LOL my idea was snubbed
atleast they took the time to make the photoshop better
Go Johnny Go!
How many articles is Nomaas going to write regarding not bringing back Damon and using Gardner in LF.
I’d say the over under is somewhere around 20.
Can you guys think of anything else to write about? Seriously.
yeah and stop stealing photoshop ideas
power to the people
My worry is damon and matsui were clutch hitters, and losing two along with the clubhouse chemistry of a guy like damon could hurt. That being said, damon wont be happy coming back at 2 mil a year anyway so the clubhouse chemistry aspect is probably moot anyway. He provides better offense than gardener, you can’t argue that, but i am an advocate for bringing in sheffield as a platoon player with gardener. Sheff still has an arm that makes both gardener and damons arm look like a five year old girls, and can scare opposing pitchers off the bench. Torre’s gone meaning that drama would be avoided, and shef always said he wanted to retire a yankee why not upgrdae the bench in a big way and plug sheff in
Can you guys think of anything else to write about? Seriously.
what else is there to write about? LF is the only position that might change between now and opening day.
the roster is basically set, and nothing else is really happening.
Sheff is an ok idea on paper. in reality, it would probably start off well and then slowly devolve into a constant stream of bitching about playing time and money by about June. i know this because this is how every season goes for Sheff.
sheffield has to be the stupidest idea i have ever read, if i were nomaas i would do a photoshop of you in a clown suit juggling sheff’s balls
if they are going to bring a broken down leftfielder then it might as well be damon…sheffiield pfftttt my god, my gooddd!@!!!
the only options are rocco or reed johnson, other than that a trade but we dont need no allstar in every position, i pitty the fools
I like the idea of Gardner if LF, though it would be nice to have someone like Nady (the Nady of 2 years ago, who killed left handed pitching) as a platoon partner.
Remember we had the best team of all time with a Shane Spencer/Ricky Ledee platoon in LF.
Mention Johnny Damon and lots of people get their panties in a bunch.
I’m gonna laugh when Gardy provides awesome defense and horrible hitting and we see a lot more Jamie Hoffman than we expected.
LF next year will be league average or so. I’m ok with that.
Jim Edmonds > Johnny Damon.
Post insults below.
if they are going to bring a broken down leftfielder then it might as well be damon…
This implies they carry the same pricetag. Which we know they won’t.
I still don’t think Sheff is worth the aggrevation, but this isn’t a very compelling argument.
OBLIGATORY SHELLEY DUNCAN POST! *SMASH* *GROWL*
Everyone mentions losing Matsui and Damon as huge blows. The ones who complain about losing them fail to realize that both are older players and had some of their best seasons when they were playing for a new contract (even though neither saw anything near what they expected). Damon will be a year older. His defense will be a year worse and his offense…come on. His offense was good, but it was an abnormality. Does anyone really expect him to hit the same next year? Most of the time a player in the twilight of his career will have 1 last “good” season before fizzling out. I definitely think this was Damon’s “last hurrah”.
I love Gardner, and I think he could definitely improve (he’s done it througout the minors and even improved over his first call up in the majors), but he won’t bring the offense that Damon did. I’m ok with that though. We have a STACKED team. 1-9 we have the best lineup in all of baseball, even with Gardner there. His speed helps inject life into our lineup (and I think Granderson will also help). However, defense is the main thing that will change thanks to Garder. Face it, Damon’s defense sucked, plain and simple. Anyone who says he wasn’t an adventure in LF didn’t watch many games. On nearly every fly ball Damon would stumble around like he was drunk. He made a lot of catches so much more difficult than they should have been. That’s not the kind of player you want out there. He’s a DH and we have a DH. We have no need for him.
His pricetag has dropped insanely low. But that doesn’t mean we have to jump in and get him just because he’s cheap now. If that were the case then we’d have signed Abreu last year when he only cost $5 mil. Abreu went on to have a fine season, but at least he had an arm. His defense looked about the same as Damon’s did, but at least Abreu got the ball in quickly. Hell, last year Abreu looked less afraid of the OF wall than Damon did. If that doesn’t show how poor Damon’s defense has gotten then I don’t know what will.
This team will do just fine with Gardner. A .270 AVG/.350 OBP and we’re talking 60 steals. When Gardner is on 2nd we’ll have Jeter up…I don’t know about anyone else here but Gardner in scoring position a lot of the time, with Jeter after him, that just seems to scream lots of scoring opportunities…
I’m very content with Gardner in LF. I’d like Reed Johnson to provide depth, but I truly think Gardner could hold his own. I’m not saying he’s going to be an All-Star, but you don’t always need a “big name” in every position. Shane Spencer, Chad Curtis, etc, etc. We can win with Gardner.
Gardner’s stats were far from incredible last year, but he wasn’t “overmatched”. He hit decently and played great defense. Damon was great but he’s also old and could fall off at any time…remember how poorly he hit in September? The “porch” didn’t help him much there.
As for people whining that we shouldn’t care about money, we’re discussing what the YANKEES should do and the YANKEES already said they do care about money, brainiacs. If you want to go live in a fantasy world, then let’s trade Edwar Ramirez for Albert Pujols, Albaladejo for Roy Halladay, and I hear the Giants needed a new bag of baseballs, let’s get Lincecum too. WHO CARES WE’RE JUST FANS WE CAN SAY ANYTHING WE WANT. Here in the real world though, the Yankees have a budget this season and don’t give a shit if whiny fans (who already support this team with the highest payroll by far) complain that it isn’t their money.
And Nick Johnson arguably IS better than Damon. Less power, but he’ll have a much higher OBP, which is excellent in front of Teixeira and A-Rod. And while Damon is obviously faster, maybe you all weren’t watching this past year or were blinded by one play in the WS, because Damon didn’t do a lot of stealing this year.
As for the moronic comments about “postseasonz” and how Johnny’s better because of one at bat and also he caught some fly balls in the postseason (?), nothing else needs to be said.
and also he caught some fly balls in the postseason (?), nothing else needs to be said.
If it wasn’t clear, that was a joke.
im very happy with gardener ranging left, but having a power bat off the bench would be ideal and sheff would be beautiful in that role. I know he is a bit of a bitch personality wise, but joining this team, as long as he knows ahead of time what his role is going to be i could see the clubhouse helping him out. Reed johnson is a solid option too, and would be better defensively then sheff for sure, but i gotta say as an opposing pitcher, i can see my knees shaking with reed johnson pinch hitting in the bottom of the ninth
Someone get me LeRoy Neiman on speed dial. The Brett Gardner painting needs to be commissioned for Cooperstown.
They’ll have to make it longer than wide to accomodate his huge dome.
Don’t get me wrong…despite the Brett Gardner worship I will continue to be a fan of and read Nomaas. Not that anyone at Nomaas cares.
You gotta have some kind of fun with your opinion…otherwise why even bother coming to a site like this.
Brad Hawpe will be the fourth outfielder on the Rockies this year, they will be begging to shed his 7+ million dollar salary by the beginning June.
Even during his supposedley sub-par second half in 2009, Hawpe posted a 116 OPS and and a .370 OBP.
Hoffman is going to get a chance, if he doesn’t then Cashman gave Bruney away for nothing. I’ll be shocked if he doesn’t make the opening day roster. If Gardner and Hoffman shit the bed, Hawpe will be available for less than Bobby Abreu cost when he came over from Philly, but if the kids work out Cashman looks smart. If he steals Hawpe from Colorado, Cashman looks smart.
Johnny’s not coming back.
I approve this message.
Johnny Damon is a person.